A pocket watch from the 1930s

[bumo79]

Good afternoon.

Here is my oldest Zodiac pocket watch from 1930 in rose gold. Pretty good condition for a 90+ year old watch. By the way, I wanted to check if the attachments work. Cheers !!!

[YuriyV]

Do you have a picture of the movement?
I doubt it is from 1930s
Nice piece though

[bumo79]

This was the year stated in the ad of the seller from whom I bought it. I will try to open it and add a picture. A pocket Chronometre (movement only) appeared on a Swiss sales portal. I plan to purchase it and make it into a wristwatch. Unfortunately, it will be huge, as the movement itself is 36mm and the crown at 12 o'clock

[YuriyV]

Thank you in advance for providing more input regarding the movement. It is interesting to take a look under the hood.
My doubts based on using marketing feature Incasecurit. It refers to anti shock device, used in movement. And usually Incasecurit featured Zodiac wrist watches dated late 1940s or early 1950s. But Incabloc was patented in 1934 if memory serves me right.
Intriguing to see what kind of anti shock device used here.

[bumo79]

Here are pictures of the movement. Unfortunately it does not have any markings, the only ones are on the case back.
Are the photos enough for us to determine the date of manufacture ?

[Butch]

This could be interesting. I personally have always ignored the Zodiac Pocket wacthes as that part of horology does not interest me in the slightest. Thank you for sharing this with the forum.

[YuriyV]

Thanks for submitting photos.
It is hard to be certain about exact dating. But we can guess by triangulating visible properties to some known information. For instance, caliber. It reminds me Alpina 2XX model line from 1930s. Later it became Unitas 2XX series. And then famous ETA 6497 still in production up to these days. By parts finish and machining applied I'd speculate it won't be 1930s. And I'm sure this particular shock protection device was done on Zodiac factory by modifying ebauche caliber.
There are other interesting things visible - assay marks on the silver case. Especially "FFBA 43". I think 43 could indicate year of case manufacture/certification/assay . So most likely the watch from 1940s. Just guessing.
But anyway, it is very interesting piece. It would be very sorry if it will be converted to a wrist watch. Small piece of Zodiac history will disappear.
As alternative, I'd suggest to use a modern ETA caliber of the same size for your wrist watch project. Take a look at ETA 6498. It is same but it has different layout where your crown will be on 3 o'clock and sub-second at 6. Exactly what you need for wrist watch.

[Butch]

I did a quick google this morning and went down a rabbit hole for 30 min. and then STOPPED. Getting to old for a new hobby. Found this at the end though. Dunno if accurate.

FFBA = is the marquee of the Fédération des Fabricants de Boîtes Argent (FFBA)

Searched Incasecurit in the forum and turned up some interesting threads.

OK, coffee please!

[bumo79]

Dear gentlemen thank you very much for the extensive information.
I am happy to be a part of this forum. I collect Zodiac watches exclusively and find the pocket watch an interesting addition to my collection. I have had it for two years and want to keep it in original condition. I found a working movement with dial and hands in Switzerland, I like it very much and it is from it that I plan to make a wristwatch. I wonder if it's not the legendary Triumph cal.1617, but I'm not sure. The cost is about $160, I think it is a fair price. Among Zodiac pocket watches there is a very rare limited edition model with a beautiful engraving depicting a scene from a horse-drawn carriage race, produced on behalf of a French organizer. Over the past 12 years, only 2 pieces have appeared on European sales portals. They sold out immediately and I didn't even manage to take a screen shot.I will add a picture in this topic as soon as this watch reappears. Greetings !

[Butch]

Please share it with us when completed.

[bumo79]

Of course, I will add photos as soon as the project is ready.
Browsing the internet today I came across an interesting piece of material regarding FFBA from which it appears that 43 is rather not the production date but the case manufacturer's designation = Jean Paratte Sarl. In the link below is the entire list of manufacturers affiliated with the FFBA. Greetings !

http://uhrenpaul.eu/Uhrenseite/Technik/Kollektiv-3.php

[YuriyV]

Among Zodiac pocket watches there is a very rare limited edition model with a beautiful engraving depicting a scene from a horse-drawn carriage race, produced on behalf of a French organizer.

It was a 100 Zodiac watch Anniversary limited edition, issued 19 Jul 1982 on Yverdon-les-Bains where Zodiac watches was a sponsor. Watch named Rand Prix as stated on the dial. Only 500 were issued. Movement - ETA 6497.

[bumo79]

Something amazing. Thank you so much Yuriy for sharing these pictures and information about this model. I have been looking for this watch for several years and would like to complete my collection with it. You mentioned in an earlier post, "the infamous ETA 6497", does that mean it is weak and breaks ? Exactly this movement drives this limited edition pocket watch that interests me. Thank you for your reply.

[YuriyV]

You mentioned in an earlier post, "the infamous ETA 6497", does that mean it is weak and breaks ?

LOL, typo. My T9 reversed meaning here. Should be famous.